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	<title>Comments on: Safety ground is not reliable ground reference</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.epanorama.net/blog/2009/06/26/safety-ground-is-not-reliable-ground-reference/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>https://www.epanorama.net/blog/2009/06/26/safety-ground-is-not-reliable-ground-reference/</link>
	<description>All about electronics and circuit design</description>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Tomi Engdahl</title>
		<link>https://www.epanorama.net/blog/2009/06/26/safety-ground-is-not-reliable-ground-reference/comment-page-1/#comment-1707705</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tomi Engdahl]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Apr 2021 08:03:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.epanorama.net/blog/?p=229#comment-1707705</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Earth Terminal Voltage Drop TN-C-S
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iozyjrPmY7U

How the earth terminal on a TN-C-S supply can be at a different voltage to the true Earth.

As the neutral and earth conductor are combined outside the installation, current in the neutral causes a voltage drop, which results in the earth terminal having a different potential (voltage) to the true Earth outside.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Earth Terminal Voltage Drop TN-C-S<br />
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iozyjrPmY7U" rel="nofollow">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iozyjrPmY7U</a></p>
<p>How the earth terminal on a TN-C-S supply can be at a different voltage to the true Earth.</p>
<p>As the neutral and earth conductor are combined outside the installation, current in the neutral causes a voltage drop, which results in the earth terminal having a different potential (voltage) to the true Earth outside.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Tomi Engdahl</title>
		<link>https://www.epanorama.net/blog/2009/06/26/safety-ground-is-not-reliable-ground-reference/comment-page-1/#comment-1584706</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tomi Engdahl]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Mar 2018 10:30:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.epanorama.net/blog/?p=229#comment-1584706</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Understanding Rise of Earth Potential
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ziOKoWEIDH8

AC substation grounding for safety
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NXtA5rxJXGA]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Understanding Rise of Earth Potential<br />
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ziOKoWEIDH8" rel="nofollow">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ziOKoWEIDH8</a></p>
<p>AC substation grounding for safety<br />
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NXtA5rxJXGA" rel="nofollow">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NXtA5rxJXGA</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Tomi Engdahl</title>
		<link>https://www.epanorama.net/blog/2009/06/26/safety-ground-is-not-reliable-ground-reference/comment-page-1/#comment-1543681</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tomi Engdahl]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Apr 2017 15:55:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.epanorama.net/blog/?p=229#comment-1543681</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[In power cables with twisted PE conductors a common mode voltage is induced by currents in the
phase conductors. This is valid even in the case of balanced currents and to the fact that the PE
conductor has a certain asymmetry with respect to the phase conductors resulting in a net magnetic
°ux through the loop built up by the PE conductor and structures of the equipotential bonding
system. The amplitude of the induced voltage depends strongly on the loop length but only slightly
on the loop width and on cable parameters such as twist length or conductor cross-section. Hence
a mutual inductance per unit length can be derived to express the induced voltage. It is in the
range of about 70{100 nH/m and can be used to estimate induced common mode currents.

UPE = 2¼fIMNET (7)
with MNET as the net mutual inductance derived from the superposition of the individual mutual
inductances. According to this relation a mutual inductance M0N
ET = 70 nH per meter length
results when the induced voltage UPE is considered as derived above. The mutual inductance
is expected to depend on several cable parameters.

It shall be mentioned that this phenomenon takes place for cables with twisted PE conductors
only. It does not exist in the case of cables with concentric PE conductors which therefore should
preferably be used when low magnetic stray ﬁelds are required.

Source:
Inductive Coupling between Wires in Cables with a Grounded Conductor
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/266065334_Inductive_Coupling_between_Wires_in_Cables_with_a_Grounded_Conductor]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In power cables with twisted PE conductors a common mode voltage is induced by currents in the<br />
phase conductors. This is valid even in the case of balanced currents and to the fact that the PE<br />
conductor has a certain asymmetry with respect to the phase conductors resulting in a net magnetic<br />
°ux through the loop built up by the PE conductor and structures of the equipotential bonding<br />
system. The amplitude of the induced voltage depends strongly on the loop length but only slightly<br />
on the loop width and on cable parameters such as twist length or conductor cross-section. Hence<br />
a mutual inductance per unit length can be derived to express the induced voltage. It is in the<br />
range of about 70{100 nH/m and can be used to estimate induced common mode currents.</p>
<p>UPE = 2¼fIMNET (7)<br />
with MNET as the net mutual inductance derived from the superposition of the individual mutual<br />
inductances. According to this relation a mutual inductance M0N<br />
ET = 70 nH per meter length<br />
results when the induced voltage UPE is considered as derived above. The mutual inductance<br />
is expected to depend on several cable parameters.</p>
<p>It shall be mentioned that this phenomenon takes place for cables with twisted PE conductors<br />
only. It does not exist in the case of cables with concentric PE conductors which therefore should<br />
preferably be used when low magnetic stray ﬁelds are required.</p>
<p>Source:<br />
Inductive Coupling between Wires in Cables with a Grounded Conductor<br />
<a href="https://www.researchgate.net/publication/266065334_Inductive_Coupling_between_Wires_in_Cables_with_a_Grounded_Conductor" rel="nofollow">https://www.researchgate.net/publication/266065334_Inductive_Coupling_between_Wires_in_Cables_with_a_Grounded_Conductor</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: kitchendecortips.blogg.org</title>
		<link>https://www.epanorama.net/blog/2009/06/26/safety-ground-is-not-reliable-ground-reference/comment-page-1/#comment-1507602</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[kitchendecortips.blogg.org]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Aug 2016 03:48:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.epanorama.net/blog/?p=229#comment-1507602</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thanks on your marvelous posting! I certainly enjoyed reading it, you can be 
a great author.I will remember to bookmark your blog and definitely will come back from now on. I want to encourage you to ultimately continue your great work, have a nice holiday 
weekend!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks on your marvelous posting! I certainly enjoyed reading it, you can be<br />
a great author.I will remember to bookmark your blog and definitely will come back from now on. I want to encourage you to ultimately continue your great work, have a nice holiday<br />
weekend!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Tomi Engdahl</title>
		<link>https://www.epanorama.net/blog/2009/06/26/safety-ground-is-not-reliable-ground-reference/comment-page-1/#comment-1490690</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tomi Engdahl]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 May 2016 09:54:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.epanorama.net/blog/?p=229#comment-1490690</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Intersil
Over-Voltage Protection for RS-485 Bus Node
http://www.intersil.com/content/dam/Intersil/whitepapers/interface/overvoltage-protection-rs485-bus-nodes.pdf

Robustness and reliability have made RS-485 the industrial workhorse over the past 40 years. Its large 
differential signal swing of 1.5V minimum and reliable operation over a wide common-mode voltage range  of -7V to +12V have catapulted the RS-485’s widespread deployment. Initially used as a communication  network in laboratory instrumentation, RS-485 has spread to control networks in industrial and building automation, PLC networks on the factory floor, process control, commercial heating, ventilation and air-conditioning systems, seismic networks, traffic monitoring systems, and alarm indication systems in oil rigs, coal mines and the petro-chemical industry.

this white paper focuses on: RS-485 transceiver protection against large over-voltages. 

The 24V and 48V DC supplies in industrial and telecom systems are commonly distributed through the same conduits as the data lines of an RS-485 network.

If a DC supply shares the same connector or screw terminal block with the data lines of a
n adjacent bus node circuit, miss-wiring faults can occur that connect one or more supply conductors with the transceiver bus terminals.

Another failure cause is the layout of the conduit. Sharp bends often violate the minimum cable radius 
specified for data and supply cables. Over time, the increased mechanical pressure on the cable will cause a break in the insulation, causing shorts between power and data lines. 

Engineers new to over-voltage protection often assume that adding external transient voltage suppressors (TVS) to a non-fault protected, standard transceiver ensures protection against short-and long-term over-voltages. 

to protect your bus nodes against the wide range of over-voltages, you need fault-protected transceivers, such as Intersil’s ISL3245xE family. These transceivers provide protection against DC over-voltages of up to ±60V and transient over -voltages of up to ±80V.

Occasionally the question arises: Why not use a non-fault protected, standard transceiver and a few discrete low-cost transistors with sufficient high voltage breakdown for over-voltage protection? 
The answer is simple: A discrete solution adds more cost and development time, and it consumes more space than a fault-protected transceiver.

Fault-protected transceivers with common-mode ranges wider than specified in the RS-485 standard require double fold-back current limiting within the driver stage.

 current limiting scheme ensures that the output current never exceeds the RS-485 specification, even at the common modeand fault condition voltage range extremes]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Intersil<br />
Over-Voltage Protection for RS-485 Bus Node<br />
<a href="http://www.intersil.com/content/dam/Intersil/whitepapers/interface/overvoltage-protection-rs485-bus-nodes.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.intersil.com/content/dam/Intersil/whitepapers/interface/overvoltage-protection-rs485-bus-nodes.pdf</a></p>
<p>Robustness and reliability have made RS-485 the industrial workhorse over the past 40 years. Its large<br />
differential signal swing of 1.5V minimum and reliable operation over a wide common-mode voltage range  of -7V to +12V have catapulted the RS-485’s widespread deployment. Initially used as a communication  network in laboratory instrumentation, RS-485 has spread to control networks in industrial and building automation, PLC networks on the factory floor, process control, commercial heating, ventilation and air-conditioning systems, seismic networks, traffic monitoring systems, and alarm indication systems in oil rigs, coal mines and the petro-chemical industry.</p>
<p>this white paper focuses on: RS-485 transceiver protection against large over-voltages. </p>
<p>The 24V and 48V DC supplies in industrial and telecom systems are commonly distributed through the same conduits as the data lines of an RS-485 network.</p>
<p>If a DC supply shares the same connector or screw terminal block with the data lines of a<br />
n adjacent bus node circuit, miss-wiring faults can occur that connect one or more supply conductors with the transceiver bus terminals.</p>
<p>Another failure cause is the layout of the conduit. Sharp bends often violate the minimum cable radius<br />
specified for data and supply cables. Over time, the increased mechanical pressure on the cable will cause a break in the insulation, causing shorts between power and data lines. </p>
<p>Engineers new to over-voltage protection often assume that adding external transient voltage suppressors (TVS) to a non-fault protected, standard transceiver ensures protection against short-and long-term over-voltages. </p>
<p>to protect your bus nodes against the wide range of over-voltages, you need fault-protected transceivers, such as Intersil’s ISL3245xE family. These transceivers provide protection against DC over-voltages of up to ±60V and transient over -voltages of up to ±80V.</p>
<p>Occasionally the question arises: Why not use a non-fault protected, standard transceiver and a few discrete low-cost transistors with sufficient high voltage breakdown for over-voltage protection?<br />
The answer is simple: A discrete solution adds more cost and development time, and it consumes more space than a fault-protected transceiver.</p>
<p>Fault-protected transceivers with common-mode ranges wider than specified in the RS-485 standard require double fold-back current limiting within the driver stage.</p>
<p> current limiting scheme ensures that the output current never exceeds the RS-485 specification, even at the common modeand fault condition voltage range extremes</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Kostenlos Paysafecard</title>
		<link>https://www.epanorama.net/blog/2009/06/26/safety-ground-is-not-reliable-ground-reference/comment-page-1/#comment-105428</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Kostenlos Paysafecard]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Feb 2014 00:21:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.epanorama.net/blog/?p=229#comment-105428</guid>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Lillie</title>
		<link>https://www.epanorama.net/blog/2009/06/26/safety-ground-is-not-reliable-ground-reference/comment-page-1/#comment-4016</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Lillie]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Jul 2013 05:53:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.epanorama.net/blog/?p=229#comment-4016</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It&#039;s very trouble-free to find out any matter on web as compared to textbooks, as I found this article at this web page.]]></description>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Grounding issues and minimizing EMI &#171; Tomi Engdahl&#8217;s ePanorama blog</title>
		<link>https://www.epanorama.net/blog/2009/06/26/safety-ground-is-not-reliable-ground-reference/comment-page-1/#comment-4015</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Grounding issues and minimizing EMI &#171; Tomi Engdahl&#8217;s ePanorama blog]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Apr 2013 20:55:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.epanorama.net/blog/?p=229#comment-4015</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] necessary safety functions. Grounding also have other functions in some applications (for example work as signal ground reference) but the safety should not be compromised in any [...] ]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] necessary safety functions. Grounding also have other functions in some applications (for example work as signal ground reference) but the safety should not be compromised in any [...] </p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Avery Zerkle</title>
		<link>https://www.epanorama.net/blog/2009/06/26/safety-ground-is-not-reliable-ground-reference/comment-page-1/#comment-4014</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Avery Zerkle]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Oct 2012 04:04:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.epanorama.net/blog/?p=229#comment-4014</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Fantastic post. I found it very informative.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fantastic post. I found it very informative.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Karima Nanfito</title>
		<link>https://www.epanorama.net/blog/2009/06/26/safety-ground-is-not-reliable-ground-reference/comment-page-1/#comment-4008</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Karima Nanfito]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Apr 2012 23:39:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.epanorama.net/blog/?p=229#comment-4008</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thank you for the stupendous help on runescape! I&#039;ll be reading more articles and learning even more.]]></description>
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